The media constantly fixating on the guns, I'm not saying a free for all on them but the guns didn't shoot these people by themselves. I'm sure if there were no guns these mindless killings would happen with an alternative weapon.

You have to be over 18 to buy a fork (that how you spell fork? Doesn't look right) anyway the knee jerk comment above is one concern that hopefully should be addressed sensibly.

But the problem with guns is that a gunman can kill quickly, easily and from a distance; that's what guns are designed for. From reports on Channel 4 news it seems this guy had a sniper rifle with a scope and there need to be serious questions asked about how he came to be in possession of it. I can't imagine killing sprees as high as 12 (so far) with any weapons other than guns. You can run from, say, a knifeman but you can't outrun a bullet.*



*unless you're Chuck Norris of course.

Anything beyond arm length is apt to make for a lot of casualties because it's very hard to stop some one who can hurt you before you get to them. Guns are the most efficient tool we've designed for doing the job but there are others as well. Bows, for example. I know people who can put a steel tipped arrow in a moving target with significant force at 40 or 50 feet. That might not be as certain to kill you as a bullet but it's still got a pretty good chance.

Scoped hunting rifles are allowed in certain areas - in the north of Scotland for example - where hunting of large animals is done. But I thought the controls on who gets to do so were very strict. If he's managed to get one in Cumbria someone somewhere has messed up.


Knives can still be thrown and can be lethal when doing so. It's sadly the case that if someone just wants to go on a killing spree they can do it quite well with impromptu weapons if they're determined enough - it takes a brave soul to tackle someone if you've just seen them kill someone else. Nevertheless if he has managed to get hold of what has been reported he used, the system has failed.

Jon

Cumbria has a large deer population so that would be the reason for him having a scoped rifle. Even so there are way more illegal weapons in this country.

Guardian clicky
"One relative reported that Bird had been bequeathed "a load of guns" in his father's will."
I don't think he had a licence, though there hasn't been any mention of that in any of the reports I've heard and read.

Mark

A 4x4 with bars on the front could easily be a weapon. I don't disagree we should look at the gun control but it annoys me that more focus is not put onto how someone ends up in these situations.

That was my point re better mental health provisions.

Last time I remember anything like this happening was in Dunblane in 96.
Thankfully it's harder to get guns here than in some other places.

Why the f**k would they shut down a nuclear power station? Surely there are heavily armed guards there who would have machine gunned him to death if he'd tried to get in. I'll bet the staff would feel safer inside too.

However that is a very rare skill, it is much easier to shoot people dead than kill them with bows and arrows. I believe that the British army, horribly under-equipped though it may be, has largely given up on bows and arrows for this sort of reason.

And I would hazard a guess that even the best of those archers would fail to kill a passer by while at the wheel of a moving Citroen.

Anyone among us can, if they put some time and effort into the planning and commissioning of the deed, easily become a mass murderer without the aid of firearms*. But if you want to go out in what seems to be a blaze of petulant glory - which is the usual motive for this sort of event - then guns are definitely preferred. It's not only a practical choice, these people are very mad and very angry, and guns have a powerful psychological resonance for a mind in that condition.

Anyone else keep reading this as "hunt for german" ?

Not quite. I just wanted to know which number had been murdered. Maybe the 3 of spades? Off with their head!

Personally that was what I was aiming at. I'm curious as to whether there were any indicators of his mental health when it came to obtaining/renewing his licence or whether it was just another trigger that set him off that there were no hints of.

It sounds like it started earlier than first thought as the Police found his twin brother and solicitor shot dead. Shooting a twin, can't say I've heard many cases of that, if any.

At least the media seems to be looking for reasons rather than in cases where children have been involved where they've just classed them as 'evil'.

From the reports on the BBC and from an interview with a police officer, the man had a license for all the firearms he was in possession of.

Yup, I just heard media asking if gun laws should now be looked at. Not sure how that would make any difference, the guy was quite well liked/respected so I don't think any change in the gun laws would have changed it.