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Brexit Britain 
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timark_uk wrote:
MrStevenRogers wrote:
we will not collect 200 ...
Or the promised £350 million for the NHS.
Let's not forget about that, eh?

Mark


1. we haven't left the EU (just yet, sadly)
2. £20 billion has been promised ...

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Sat Jun 30, 2018 4:01 pm
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Spreadie wrote:
MrStevenRogers wrote:
i dont need a get out of jail card, we are leaving, we will not pass go we will not collect 200 ...

What was I saying about glib BS comments in place of substantive argument?


a substantive argument.
17.4 million voted leave

end of substantive argument ...

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Sat Jun 30, 2018 4:04 pm
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MrStevenRogers wrote:
im not the one posting project fear, tick tock tick tock ...


You’re the one dismissing everything as being “project fear”. It‘s the standard leaver response to any counter argument, and when asked for anything more substantive to back up the unbridled optimism, nothing is offered. Indeed, the standard leaver response is to attempt to silence any counter argument.

I put it to you directly: there is no benefit to leaving the EU, we will all suffer as a result. I have yet to hear a proactive Brexit argument that bears up to any scrutiny. There is nothing. We’re in a tin bath on wheels steered by buffoons and incompetents heading down a steep hill towards a ditch and a dry stone wall. You can hear the audience laughing.

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Sat Jun 30, 2018 10:52 pm
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Certainly we'll suffer in the short term. Jobs will go, and companies will reduce investment. The biggest worries being banking as that generates so much money and aviation/auto which employs tens of thousands of transferable jobs.

In the long term (several decades) I still think the EU (or at least the Eurozone) will implode unless it actually does become one state, with central taxes and a central budget. If Greece doesn't bring them down, there's serious potential that Italy will. In it's current state the EU moves so slow politically, it can't react fast enough to deal with a sudden crisis, and that's assuming there's a will to fix it. If the members of the commission don't want to fix something, then it's not going to be given to the parliament to vote on.

Strangely the biggest problem the EU has the short term is America.
America -> regime change in middle ease -> refugees and economic migrants in huge numbers -> resentment from countries that they arrive at -> Political division between those countries and other EU countries that don't.
That's how it appears on the news at the moment anyway.

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Sun Jul 01, 2018 5:44 am
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l3v1ck wrote:
Certainly we'll suffer in the short term. Jobs will go, and companies will reduce investment. The biggest worries being banking as that generates so much money and aviation/auto which employs tens of thousands of transferable jobs.

In the long term (several decades) I still think the EU (or at least the Eurozone) will implode unless it actually does become one state, with central taxes and a central budget. If Greece doesn't bring them down, there's serious potential that Italy will. In it's current state the EU moves so slow politically, it can't react fast enough to deal with a sudden crisis, and that's assuming there's a will to fix it. If the members of the commission don't want to fix something, then it's not going to be given to the parliament to vote on.

Strangely the biggest problem the EU has the short term is America.
America -> regime change in middle ease -> refugees and economic migrants in huge numbers -> resentment from countries that they arrive at -> Political division between those countries and other EU countries that don't.
That's how it appears on the news at the moment anyway.


1. if we leave without a deal (which looks likely) then massively reduced business taxes for companies will be put in place.
2. the stop of 'free movement' (not immigration) will ensure high employment remains for the short term and improves over the long term.
3. banksters will always find a way regardless of the rules, regs or laws.
4. thankfully the USA are taking the EU head on, end result, EU loses.
5. i dont really care what happens to the EU, whether it remains or most likely folds, they made their bed they will have to lay in it.
6. once independent we make are own way, our own rules, our own laws which the EU will have no sway in.

happy days for the UK, total hardship for the EU and thats only just the start as 'things can only get better'.
there you have it 'optimism' ...

and just to add.
Quote:
Zut alors! De Gaulle was the first to predict Brexit.
Charles de Gaulle was the unlikely prophet of Brexit according to a new biography.


https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics ... r-napoleon

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Sun Jul 01, 2018 6:16 am
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MrStevenRogers wrote:

1. if we leave without a deal (which looks likely) then massively reduced business taxes for companies will be put in place. If business taxes are lowered then there's an even bigger shortfall for the government, this means pensions, the NHS etc will go & income tax will rise
2. the stop of 'free movement' (not immigration) will ensure high employment remains for the short term and improves over the long term. B0llocks, the entire reason we have skilled migrants is that British people aren't training for these jobs or are too lazy to work in lower paid jobs
3. banksters will always find a way regardless of the rules, regs or laws. Nope, they'll go. Can't have the UK as your European base if they're not in Europe
4. thankfully the USA are taking the EU head on, end result, EU loses. If the USA win then everybody is dead, they're a bunch of fcuktards
5. i dont really care what happens to the EU, whether it remains or most likely folds, they made their bed they will have to lay in it. Somebody here has no idea how politics work
6. once independent we make are own way, our own rules, our own laws which the EU will have no sway in.
Oh joy, no paid holiday, human rights etc

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Mon Jul 02, 2018 7:30 am
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MrStevenRogers wrote:

1. if we leave without a deal (which looks likely) then massively reduced business taxes for companies will be put in place.
2. the stop of 'free movement' (not immigration) will ensure high employment remains for the short term and improves over the long term.
3. banksters will always find a way regardless of the rules, regs or laws.
4. thankfully the USA are taking the EU head on, end result, EU loses.
5. i dont really care what happens to the EU, whether it remains or most likely folds, they made their bed they will have to lay in it.
6. once independent we make are own way, our own rules, our own laws which the EU will have no sway in.



OK, so where is you EVIDENCE for this - or is this Project Blind Optimism?

1/ Massively reduced business taxes is simply a race to the bottom. End result is that all nations lose. The only winners are the multinational businesses such as Amazon or Apple who simply keep switching their tax regime to the lowest area.

2/ As already stated, we need immigration to fill the jobs the natives don't want. This has been happening since windrush. Also, immigration (free movement) is hugely beneficial to the economy due to higher tax take etc.

3/ Correct - the banksters WILL find a way, but it won't be here. I don't know how many bankers you know, but those I am friendly with are more than happy to, and in many cases have already, move(d) to another country to work. There are multiple financial centres in Europe just waiting to take over from the City of London.

4/ The EU and USA have roughly the same GDP - About 19 Trillian Euros. A trade war between these two behemoths will result in no winners - it will be hugely damaging for both economies and in fact globally.

5/ You really should. It will effect UK Plc massively if it fails - in or out. Think global recession.

6/ So exactly which EU Laws do you object to? Human rights? Clean water? Carbon reduction? Working time directive?

If you would like the evidence for any of my points, I'll more than happily share - although its all project fear to you.

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Mon Jul 02, 2018 11:01 am
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didgeman wrote:
MrStevenRogers wrote:

1. if we leave without a deal (which looks likely) then massively reduced business taxes for companies will be put in place.
2. the stop of 'free movement' (not immigration) will ensure high employment remains for the short term and improves over the long term.
3. banksters will always find a way regardless of the rules, regs or laws.
4. thankfully the USA are taking the EU head on, end result, EU loses.
5. i dont really care what happens to the EU, whether it remains or most likely folds, they made their bed they will have to lay in it.
6. once independent we make are own way, our own rules, our own laws which the EU will have no sway in.



OK, so where is you EVIDENCE for this - or is this Project Blind Optimism?

1/ Massively reduced business taxes is simply a race to the bottom. End result is that all nations lose. The only winners are the multinational businesses such as Amazon or Apple who simply keep switching their tax regime to the lowest area.

2/ As already stated, we need immigration to fill the jobs the natives don't want. This has been happening since windrush. Also, immigration (free movement) is hugely beneficial to the economy due to higher tax take etc.

3/ Correct - the banksters WILL find a way, but it won't be here. I don't know how many bankers you know, but those I am friendly with are more than happy to, and in many cases have already, move(d) to another country to work. There are multiple financial centres in Europe just waiting to take over from the City of London.

4/ The EU and USA have roughly the same GDP - About 19 Trillian Euros. A trade war between these two behemoths will result in no winners - it will be hugely damaging for both economies and in fact globally.

5/ You really should. It will effect UK Plc massively if it fails - in or out. Think global recession.

6/ So exactly which EU Laws do you object to? Human rights? Clean water? Carbon reduction? Working time directive?

If you would like the evidence for any of my points, I'll more than happily share - although its all project fear to you.


i would sooner project optimism then the on going project fear ...

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Mon Jul 02, 2018 9:35 pm
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saspro wrote:
MrStevenRogers wrote:

1. if we leave without a deal (which looks likely) then massively reduced business taxes for companies will be put in place. If business taxes are lowered then there's an even bigger shortfall for the government, this means pensions, the NHS etc will go & income tax will rise
2. the stop of 'free movement' (not immigration) will ensure high employment remains for the short term and improves over the long term. B0llocks, the entire reason we have skilled migrants is that British people aren't training for these jobs or are too lazy to work in lower paid jobs
3. banksters will always find a way regardless of the rules, regs or laws. Nope, they'll go. Can't have the UK as your European base if they're not in Europe
4. thankfully the USA are taking the EU head on, end result, EU loses. If the USA win then everybody is dead, they're a bunch of fcuktards
5. i dont really care what happens to the EU, whether it remains or most likely folds, they made their bed they will have to lay in it. Somebody here has no idea how politics work
6. once independent we make are own way, our own rules, our own laws which the EU will have no sway in.
Oh joy, no paid holiday, human rights etc


answers in red. i must have hit a nerve ...

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Mon Jul 02, 2018 9:38 pm
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So no evidence - no reasoned argument. Just optimism.
Thought so.

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Mon Jul 02, 2018 9:51 pm
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MrStevenRogers wrote:
[
i would sooner project optimism then the on going project fear ...


Not fear, realism.
If you think for 1 minute that the government is thinking of you when making their plans , then you're more deluded than we first thought.
We can't even produce enough food to supply the country, slap on a massive trade fee and 10's of millions more will go hungry.

And what about the millions of Brit's in Europe? No access to healthcare or housing when they're forced back (& they will be forced back).

Take your kids, if it goes the way you want, they'd have had a £150,000 bill for having your grandchild. Then another £300 a month in healthcare just so they can get their injections and see a doctor.

We can see you're bitter about something, what bad thing has being in the EU ever done to you personally?

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Wed Jul 04, 2018 6:47 am
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Not fear, realism.
If you think for 1 minute that the government is thinking of you when making their plans , then you're more deluded than we first thought.
We can't even produce enough food to supply the country, slap on a massive trade fee and 10's of millions more will go hungry.

And what about the millions of Brit's in Europe? No access to healthcare or housing when they're forced back (& they will be forced back).

Take your kids, if it goes the way you want, they'd have had a £150,000 bill for having your grandchild. Then another £300 a month in healthcare just so they can get their injections and see a doctor.

We can see you're bitter about something, what bad thing has being in the EU ever done to you personally?


i truly wonder how on earth we managed for century's without the blessed EU dictatorship.

i assume that the above figures are from the ministry of fresh air and fabrication. as the NHS is celebrating 70 years of existence which means its been around longer then the EU and i have no doubt will be around, in one form or another, long after the EU ceases to exist.

just another classic example of project fear ...

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Wed Jul 04, 2018 9:11 am
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I don't know.
If the EU can survive the Eurozone crisis over the next decade or two, then it may well last a very long time.
Maybe not in the form it is now, but in some form or another. I doubt the UK will be the only country to leave in the long term.

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Wed Jul 04, 2018 9:57 am
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l3v1ck wrote:
I don't know.
If the EU can survive the Eurozone crisis over the next decade or two, then it may well last a very long time.
Maybe not in the form it is now, but in some form or another. I doubt the UK will be the only country to leave in the long term.


i dont really care how the EfilthyU ceases to exist. be it the UK leaving, internal collapse or an outside influence invading. as long as the EU dictatorship is destroyed.
also i believe President Trump may very well be pulling out of NATO, if so, then the UK can. we can do a North Atlantic Defence Agreement between the US and the UK. leaving the EU to get on with it, things, must assuredly, can only get better ...

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Wed Jul 04, 2018 12:13 pm
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MrStevenRogers wrote:
i dont really care how the EfilthyU ceases to exist. be it the UK leaving, internal collapse or an outside influence invading. as long as the EU dictatorship is destroyed.
also i believe President Trump may very well be pulling out of NATO, if so, then the UK can. we can do a North Atlantic Defence Agreement between the US and the UK. leaving the EU to get on with it, things, must assuredly, can only get better ...

Can you show us on the doll where the EU hurt you?

What you and many brexiteers seem to neglect is that a lot of the things that you want to blame on the EU are in fact down to the UK governments implementation and choices made here rather than in Brussels or wherever. If/when we leave, that particular nest of vipers is going to be much harder to ignore. And if you don't like an non-UK power dictating our rules and laws just wait until you get a load of what a trade deal with the USA will cost us with the current president. The UK government was wildly in favour of signing up to TTIP and recently signed up to CETA, neither of which provide particularly good protections for the rights of citizens compared to the powers they grant to businesses.
The Tories and yes, New Labour before them, were all about the business and screw the people (at least as much as they think they won't notice at the time). That's not likely to change any time soon and Brexit hands these clowns more power to screw us all over in their own self interest and that of their good friends in big business.

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