I can't say I've noticed this problem (again I pump out visual over HDMI and audio via optical cable to a dedicated sound system), perhaps I'm not paying enough attention.
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| PS3 and Lip Sync http://x404.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=6442 |
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| Author: | paulzolo [ Sun Feb 21, 2010 7:12 pm ] |
| Post subject: | PS3 and Lip Sync |
Having got my TV picture to the standard I am happy with, I’ve turned my attention to the audio. Right now, I am using my PS3 as a BluRay player. However, I have been noticing a lip sync problem. It’s very, very slight, but nonetheless, it’s there and I notice it. It certainly affects how dialog is delivered - the lips just don’t match the sounds. The PS3 is connected to the TV via HDMI, and to the amp via an optical cable. A bit of digging reveals that the picture processing takes slightly more time than the audio processing, so you see the picture slightly ahead of the sound. This can be proved by turning the volume of the TV up. There is a definite “echo” - naturally, the TV syncs audio with the picture, but at amp gets the sound as it’s pumped into it. The result is a bit of an echo. After a spot of Googling, I found the solution to the problem. In the PS3 Sound options for the optical cable, switch Dolby Digital 5.1 off and keep DTS 5.1 on. Up side - lip sync seems to be sorted,. Down side - on a number of my BluRay discs, the Dolby Digital 5.1 signal is not being sent and processed by the amp, so surround sound is not utilised as much on some discs as on others. If there is a DTS signal, then that uses the amp fully. Otherwise, the audio signal is lessened. Annoying, but less annoying than lip sync being out. The ping-pong scene in Moon, for example, is a good test as the ball hitting the table is spot on now. And that [articular disc uses DTS, so full surround sound in play! I know that the proper solution would be to buy a proper BluRay player - I’d get all the digital output I’d need and hopefully no audio sync problems. Right now, thugh, I’m OK with the PS3. I thought I’d share this bit of info incase others were having similar issues. |
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| Author: | Linux_User [ Sun Feb 21, 2010 9:56 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: PS3 and Lip Sync |
I can't say I've noticed this problem (again I pump out visual over HDMI and audio via optical cable to a dedicated sound system), perhaps I'm not paying enough attention.
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| Author: | saspro [ Mon Feb 22, 2010 10:51 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: PS3 and Lip Sync |
You could just go into the menu's of your amp and adjust lipsync there (assuming it's an AVR) |
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| Author: | paulzolo [ Mon Feb 22, 2010 11:41 am ] | |||||||||
| Post subject: | Re: PS3 and Lip Sync | |||||||||
I’ve read this - I’ll have to see if the Amp is capable. But can you delay lip sync forward though? The picture appears to be behind the sound. This seems to be a normal complaint for PS3 owners from what I can gather. It can also be the HDMI version the TV is using (the firmware on the TV is up to date). |
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| Author: | saspro [ Mon Feb 22, 2010 1:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: PS3 and Lip Sync |
If the picture is behind the sound then delaying the sound should work. |
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| Author: | Nick [ Mon Feb 22, 2010 5:02 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: PS3 and Lip Sync |
Yeah, try adding a drum of optical cable. A few hundred thousand miles might bring it back in time.  
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| Author: | JJW009 [ Mon Feb 22, 2010 10:51 pm ] | |||||||||
| Post subject: | Re: PS3 and Lip Sync | |||||||||
I know you say that in jest, but there's something similar in analogue colour TVs. The monochrome signal is delayed to match the colour using a delay line, which is just a very long coil of wire. I have a couple in a draw here. http://www.hawestv.com/mtv_color%5Cdelayline.htm |
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| Author: | John_Vella [ Fri Mar 19, 2010 3:23 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: PS3 and Lip Sync |
You're not just watching badly dubbed foreign films, are you? Or maybe early spaghetti westerns? Sorry, I could have resisted but chose not to 
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| Author: | paulzolo [ Sun May 23, 2010 8:03 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: PS3 and Lip Sync |
It looks like I need a new amp - which is an arse because the one I have is jolly good, and I spent a lot of time tuning it to the room it’s in. The problem is this: the TV takes a little while to decode the picture. The audio is sent straight to the amp via fibre optic, and is played immediately. Depending on the audio setting on the PS3, the lag is bigger or smaller. I don’t know why, but DTS causes bigger lags. There are a couple of options. Option 1: introduce a delay in the audio signal from the PS3 to the amp. The amp is 8 years old, and has no delay other than setting a distance for the askers from the screen. The problem there is that it will start to sound crap. The other option is to intercept the audio between the PS3 and the amp and introduce a delay there. The problem here is that the delay would be different for every disc, AND may be different depending on the compression in various parts of the disc. Such a device will cost almost as much as a new amp anyway. Option 2: buy a new amp. The current amp has no HDMI. I bought it when I was assembling a DVD/CRT set up. HDMI appears to be the solution because, from HDMI 1.3, the TV can tell the amp how much of a delay to apply, and it syncs the soundtrack for you. You aren’t splitting the audio from the visual any more. So I need to do some research, and picking the brains of someone I know who knows an awful lot about this. I tried watching Avatar last night, and the lack of syncing sound was very frustrating, and yes, I could watch it using the TV’s speakers, but I know what my sound system can do, and I hate to watch films on a reduced system. Looks like no iPad for me for a while then. |
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| Author: | Linux_User [ Sun May 23, 2010 9:41 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: PS3 and Lip Sync |
I don't understand why there's a delay for you? The picture from my PS3 goes to the TV via HDMI, but the sound goes via optical cable to the surround sound - I don't experience any lip sync issues, so either my sound system is compensating or there's a weird issue with your setup.
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| Author: | JJW009 [ Sun May 23, 2010 11:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: PS3 and Lip Sync |
Does your TV have a digital output you could use? How long would you estimate the delay to be? |
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| Author: | paulzolo [ Tue May 25, 2010 7:25 pm ] | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Post subject: | Re: PS3 and Lip Sync | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Yes - but it does not relay the full sound signal - just PCM. This is because the sound stops being in the HDMI chain, apparently.
It really depends on the settings I am using on the PS3. It’s noticeable on the clicks from the XMB - turn up the TV volume, and the two are not always synchronised. I can reduce the delay by “stepping down” the kind of audio output to the fibre optic cable, so no DTS where the delay is worse. At best, it}s enough for me to see that the words aren’t matched to the lips of the people speaking them. At worst, it’s almost half a second. Nothing weird in the set up - the PS3 is connected via HDMI, and the amp connected using the fibre optic channel. The amp is about 8 years old, and has no connection to the TV. It also has no delay controls, so I can’t create a suitable delay.
I’d be interested to know your PS3 sound configuration settings. I have configured my TV’s picture away from the factory settings, and this has in fact reduced the amount of post processing (for example, no sharpening). I would say that this is a first generation PS3. I have been doing some Googling on this subject, and it seems that there are significant differences between audio processing on the fat PS3s and the newer slim ones due to hardware changes. |
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| Author: | JJW009 [ Tue May 25, 2010 8:07 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: PS3 and Lip Sync |
I'm curious as to how this could be resolved satisfactorily, given the two different paths to isolated devices. Basically, even if the player outputs sound and vision in a consistently synchronised fashion, the separates have absolutely no way of knowing how long the TV is going to spend post-processing the video. It might be different for every set and even for different disks, so fine tuning the delay on a replacement amp could become a very laborious chore. On the other hand, if the sound goes through the TV then it will know what the delay is and can compensate. Perhaps the video processor in Linux's TV is either massively more powerful or considerably less sophisticated than yours, so the post processing delay is not noticeable? |
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| Author: | paulzolo [ Tue May 25, 2010 8:28 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: PS3 and Lip Sync |
I think I have it - a bit more digging and I find that there is a setting in Video Settings for the PS3: BD 1080p 24Hz Output(HDMI). By default, it’s on automatic. If I switch it off, the lip sync issue seems to go away. I have no idea what this setting does, but at the moment Sigorney’s voice matches her lip movements  Will be testing other discs. |
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| Author: | JJW009 [ Tue May 25, 2010 8:49 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: PS3 and Lip Sync |
I imagine 24Hz refers to films recorded to disk in native 1080/24 as opposed to /30 or /60 used for TV shows. Not all TVs can handle 24fps so the player can convert, probably with 2:3 pulldown. |
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